This Halloween, TheEEStory.com advises you to carefully examine everything you are given to make sure you can separate trick from treat, especially if what you are hoping to bag is news regarding EEStor Inc.
Those predicting EEStor tricks were quick to devour GM-Volt.com's recent report that there would be no EESU's delivered in 2008. Many other blogs and even the New York Times (for God's sake) covered this tricky story and cited funding issues as the reason for the delay. Skeptics of EEStor's claims, (many of whom have set up camp at TheEEStory.com) reveled gluttonously in the supposed news indicating it was further proof that EEStor will not deliver on it's claims. But was this pre-halloween celebration a bit premature? Yes.
Straight from the "no news is good news file," we have this quote from Zenn Motor Company's Catherine Scrimgeour, "There is no net new news here" referring to the GM-Volt article. She went on to say that ZMC remains confident with prior publicly released statements concerning EEStor's progress to date which includes the expected delivery of......drum roll please.....a production line prototype EESU from EEStor Inc. in 2008! Further support was found with Tom Weir, General Manager and VP of Operations at EEStor Inc. who concurred with this information in a telephone interview today. So, yes Martha, you can dress up as an EESU this year....and possibly plug your laptop into your costume. :-)MUAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAAHAHAHAH <cough cough> HAHAMUAHAHA.
In the spirit of further seemingly secret activities, Zenn's Scrimgeour confirmed the "soft launch" of http://www.zennergy.com/, the beginnings of Zenn's business to business online marketing efforts. It will continue to grow as more information becomes available.
Attention bloggers and reporters busy correcting your previous stories, don't forget to cite the source. -b ;-)
Excellent. 2008 for production line prototype. The horses mouth is a better source than anything I know of. Well done again for digging under the headlines.
Have a good Halloween...
WOW!
B, thanks so much your efforts they are extremely appreciated I’m more confused then ever. Your last interview with DW however seemed to at least pre confirm or set the stage for what went out at GM-VOLT but the entire situation seemed odd anyways and really didn’t fit within the EEstory.
B, until i hear it directly from Zenn in a press release, it isn't official. As much as i appreciate your efforts, they aren't conclusive reporting.
So you're saying there's still a chance.
I think if they thru an eesu in your face you wouldn't beleive it.
eestorblog, how much can I read into your choice of a smiling pumpkin face? (?as opposed to a grumpy or scary pumpkin face?)
hi. can you confirm that the map on the zennergy drive train range page is generated dynamically? Is the center of the map the town where your ISP is located??
No, it is just a static image.
I am so glad I am going to Thailand for 3 weeks. I can put EEStor and ZENN out of my mind for a little while and not worry about changing the world. Then again... I should see Mark there... Maybe he can give me good news. :)
"Prototype" doesn't necessarily mean "working prototype" :-)
Good info however B. Thanks. Any chance of a more extensive report on those phone conversations?
Thanks for asking. I have no plans to purchase a GM-Volt.
Straight from Dr. Lyle Dennis of gm-volt.com, he told us that Dick Weir sent him the response which included:
"As we stated in the beginning of 2008, properly funded EEStor, Inc. would anticipate in being in production status late in 2008.
The funding that we did receive was not sufficient to meet the production status late in 2008 but as identified by our last news release, EEStor, Inc. has made excellent progress with that level of funding."
Weir also told MIT tech review that commercial production would start "as soon as possible in 2009" ( http://www.technologyreview.com/Energy/21171/pa... )
I think the confusion is what we are talking about... production unit? production protype? prototype? Or course, media and EEstor can spin things the way they want. Bottom line, I would not expect any serious announcements from EEstor this year, but I do expect one line their last press release ("we are closer!"). Sorry to be the pessimist on this one.
I'm getting a feel for the numbers involved with the ESU electricity storage. From the http://www.zennergy.com/ website, the ESU Comparison link uses 52 kWh as an example energy amount. They state that the ESU will fully charge 52 kWh in about 6 minutes. Some observations...
1) It just so happens 52 kWh is also the same capacity of the batteries used in the Tesla (coincidence?). So 6 minutes of fill up time at an electric gas station gives you about 200 miles range (assuming your EV is about as efficient as the Tesla).
2) Since my house averages about 1250 kWh per month, or about 42 kWh per day, that means I would have to be able to bring just under a whole days worth of electricity in 6 minutes to be able to charge the ESU at its quickest. Obviously, that is not likely to happen.
3) I drive about 900 miles per month (four and one half charges of the ESU, again assuming a Tesla equivalent EV), which costs me $90 in gas (30 mpg average, $3 per gallon). If I used 4.5 full charges of electricity per month for fuel, it would cost me $40.32 (56 kWh * 4.5 * $0.16 per kWh). So I save about half the cost of gas.
4) If I recharge every day at home, on average I will need to recharge only 15% of the total capacity of the ESU each day (56 kWh / 200 miles * 30 miles per day) = 8.4 kWh used per day. 8.4 / 56 = 15%.
5) At the same time, my average increased electric load at home is 20% (8.4 kWh / 42 kWh). The current average usage rate is 1.75 kW per hour (42 kWh / 24 hours). If I pull the entire 8.4 kWh of power within 6 minutes, this is 48 times the normal rate (8.4 kWh / 0.1 hours / 1.75 kW per hour normal usage = 48). This is all at 120 volts. It still sounds like to charge in 6 minutes, it will take 480 volts and a 100 amp circuit.
Interesting. Let me know if anyone spots any math mistakes.
EVuniverse,
Your math looks good but there are a couple of misconceptions:
1) The fast 6 minute recharge would require a second EESU that is charged using a normal household circuit. You then plug this second EESU into your car and it is this recharge that would only take about 6 minutes
2) Unlike an EESU, the Li-Ion batteries in the Tesla can't be discharged all the way so even if you have the 52 kwh figure correct, you'll need to find out how much of that is actually usable.
It may be the case that the 6 minute recharge of your EV requires a second ESU in your garage which is charging itself up at a reasonable rate around the clock in preparation for the quick 6-minute reccharge of your EV. (nervously: right, folks?) btw, my electrcity is under 9 cents/kWh
This is EVuniverse (a.k.a EVuniverse2 -- the registration has a bug in it -- it allows the creation of invalid passwords and then won't let you log in again, and no way to reset passwords)...
tvillars, I thought about that last night. I believe the Tesla is designed limit the battery discharge to about 40% charge? If the estimated range being reported for the Tesla includes this limitation then two things would be true...
1) Replacing the Tesla battery with the EEStor unit would almost double the usable range (since the ESU *can* be fully discharged without risking damage)
2) Electricity consumption is half and savings over gas is about twice my original calculations, since you would be getting 200 miles range from 28 kWh (56/2).
If correct, that makes a huge difference. So does anyone know if the Tesla range is based on only 60% battery discharge?
Different Year the same message, weirs says not this year, zenn says hang on it's commming...
Sept 11 2007 here is the reply I got from Catherine Scrimgeour about weirs delay.
Dear Mr. Jerry,
There has been no official delay communicated directly to ZENN Motor
Company. This particular is in fact misleading in its story title.
EEStor is quoted as stating that the EESU is on schedule for delivery
to
ZMC within the next ten months. That is not to say that they won't
deliver before then - merely announcing the possibility that additional
time may be required in the commercialization phase - not development
time of the ultracapacitor.
The next milestone involves permittivity testing and no official 'due
date' has been announced.
Please feel free to contact me should you have any additional questions
or concerns.
Catherine Scrimgeour
Public Affairs Specialist
ZENN Motor Company
Tel: 416.535.8395 x 201
Fax: 416.535.4043
www.ZENNcars.com
mrjerry: you have a point; but there is a bit of a difference. A year ago they said 10 months, now they're saying 2 months (confirmed by TW). That's a lot less wiggle room.
Nice scoop B.
For EEstor to maintain credibility it is imperative (IMO) that at least the certification of production EESU permittivity be announced this year. A working prototype would be a nice stand-in. If the next ZMC shareholder's meeting roles around in 2009 with no solid breakthrough in evidence, they will have some 'splainin' to do.
EVuniverse2:
According to the TM website, the "EPA-certified electricity consumption [of the Tesla Roadster 1.5] is 28 kWh per 100 miles on EPA combined cycle."
(52.2 kWh / 28 kWh) * 100 miles = 186.43 miles according to the EPA.
SMEs, please correct any inaccuracies.
Monsieur Godot will be here shortly.