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Thu, 02 Sep 2010, 12:45pm Long time climate change skeptic Bjørn Lomborg, changes his tune »
Fibb
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HEEman wrote:

I think you mean the reporting of extreme weather events has increased. Show the evidence that the actual number of events have increased please.

Hey Heeman, try hand-waving away the data and expert testimony in this MacLeans article:

I posted most of the article here because I know deniers don't usually bother actually clicking on links.

Extreme Weather Warning

Fires. Floods. Freak storms. Droughts. Why it’s only going to get worse.

(from http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/08/24/extreme-weat...

Last week, after rampant forest fires had decimated thousands of hectares of his homeland, and burned alive dozens of his countrymen, Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin boarded an amphibious aircraft to witness the blazes for himself. Within a few minutes of sitting in the passenger compartment, Putin—never one to resist a fight, or a photo op for that matter—strode briskly to the cockpit and assumed the co-pilot’s seat and headset. Upon direction, Putin, who doesn’t have his flying licence, swooped down and drew 12 tonnes of water from the Oka River, and then doused the scorching forests beneath, extinguishing two fires. All this in 30 minutes.

As superheroic as this act may have seemed, it fell drastically short: below, hundreds more raging fires were turning lush trees into charred toothpicks. At least 2,000 homes have burned down, including 341 in less than an hour. Survivors found nothing but scrap metal, which they gathered up to sell off. Farmers, meanwhile, have seen their grain crop cut by a third, and counting.

The only thing spreading faster than the fires is fear: that dangerous radioactive material on land contaminated by the Chernobyl disaster will be churned up, for instance. Experts insist that a far more realistic and deadly threat is the toxic smog that has blanketed Russia in a sepia haze ever since daily temperatures surged to 40° C and higher—hotter than it’s been there since the 11th century, the Russian weather service chief said. Government officials have warned that breathing the polluted air is like smoking multiple packs of cigarettes a day, so Russians have taken to wearing those face masks ubiquitous to disasters, most recently the H1N1 scare. They’ve also retreated to the lakes to cool off, but even this activity has been lethal: swilling too much vodka before swimming led to more than 1,000 drownings in June alone, when the heat wave began.

Before then, “Russians would have laughed if you had asked them if this would happen,” says Ghassem R. Asrar, director of the World Climate Research Programme at the UN’s World Meteorological Organization.

Normal summer temperatures there hover in the low 20s in the hottest parts. Imagining the “Great Russian heat wave of 2010,” as this hot spell has been dubbed, would have been preposterous. “They’d have said it’s like being in Saudi Arabia,” Asrar told Maclean’s.

Except that even Saudi Arabia’s weather has been extraordinary this summer, with temperatures reaching above 47° C. In fact, record heat has occurred in 17 countries, including Pakistan, where on May 26, the mercury hit 53.5° C—suffocating four people to death. Since then, the heat has given way to the unthinkable: catastrophic floods, which have killed at least 1,600 Pakistanis and ruined the homes and livelihoods of more than 20 million others. There are concerns of a cholera outbreak, and the country is now facing a shortage of drinking water. The UN, which has appealed for $460 million in immediate international aid, has called this the greatest humanitarian crisis in history—more devastating than the 2004 Southeast Asia tsunami, the 2005 Pakistan earthquake and the Haiti earthquake combined. The funds have been slow in coming, though, and some worry that the Taliban will step in instead. Worse still, there is no end in sight: forecasters warn more floods are coming, and urge “all the concerned authorities . . . to take necessary precautionary measures to avoid/minimize loss of lives and infrastructure.”

On the spectrum of extreme weather, Pakistan and Russia are obviously the worst effected. But new data shows that the whole world is experiencing unprecedented levels of radical weather. In June, the global land and ocean average surface temperature was the hottest it’s been since 1880, when the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration in the United States began keeping records. And July was the 305th consecutive month that the global temperature was above average, meaning the last time the mercury dipped unusually low was in February 1985.

Even Canada’s distinction as a moderate country hasn’t safeguarded us from outrageous weather patterns: heat waves in Ontario and Quebec have caused power outages this summer and sent a record 158 people to one Ottawa ER in a single day. Hundreds of wildfires are engulfing portions of British Columbia. And after severe droughts in the spring, the Prairies have been flooded.

If this strange and severe weather was once hard to imagine, it’s now hard to ignore. “Extreme events are becoming more common,” says Heidi Cullen, a climatologist based in Princeton, N.J., and author of the new book, The Weather of the Future. What is happening in Russia and Pakistan may not feel like a real threat to North America, but she says “it should feel real.” As the Earth continues to heat up, “who is to say that couldn’t happen in Canada or the United States?” Cullen asks. “It will happen eventually.” Asrar agrees. “We will see more extremes, and they’ll last longer and be very strong.” In other words, he says, in the future “anything is possible.”

To understand how extreme weather is becoming more common, scientists start by looking back. Over the last 100 years, the global average temperature has steadily increased by a little more than 1° F. That doesn’t seem like much. But if a typical day is going to be warmer, then the heat waves will be as well. This also affects storm activity: the hotter it gets, the more heat the oceans absorb. The heat evaporates into the atmosphere as water vapour. Warm air can hold more water vapour than cold air, so once the atmosphere is saturated, it dumps exceptional amounts of rain.

more at: http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/08/24/extreme-weat...

Climate Change, left unabatted, is going to be very expensive indeed.


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Thu, 02 Sep 2010, 12:23am Long time climate change skeptic Bjørn Lomborg, changes his tune »
Fibb
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300 ppm is probably safe.


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Thu, 02 Sep 2010, 12:19am Long time climate change skeptic Bjørn Lomborg, changes his tune »
Fibb
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Sean wrote:

Fibb wrote:

Sean wrote:

The problem is the consequences, of some knee jerk CO2 tax based on bad science is potentially catastrophic to a world economy

total FUD. And you guys condemn us for fear mongering!


As I said "Ptoentially" it may not be catastrophic , but it will be disruptive on a large scale and harm a lot more people than "global warming" ever will, and it will accomplish nothing toward the intended goal.

Many economists have crunched the numbers and said it would cost very little to get off fossil fuels via a carbon tax, and many think it will create new industries, jobs and save 100s of billions. But is has to be done slowly over time. Too bad we delayed a decade or two already!

Not acting is actually very costly. How large were the economic losses in Pakistan and Russia recently? In a matter of a few weeks of extreme weather, 100s of millions of dollars of infrastructure were washed away and crops were destroyed. The frequency of extreme weather events is rising and so is their cost.


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Wed, 01 Sep 2010, 8:13pm Long time climate change skeptic Bjørn Lomborg, changes his tune »
Fibb
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Sean wrote:

The problem is the consequences, of some knee jerk CO2 tax based on bad science is potentially catastrophic to a world economy

total FUD. And you guys condemn us for fear mongering!


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Wed, 01 Sep 2010, 4:49pm Long time climate change skeptic Bjørn Lomborg, changes his tune »
Fibb
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A revenue neutral carbon tax would be good too. Lower income taxes as you increase carbon taxes.

Why are we taxing good things like income, and not taxing things we don't want - like pollution?


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Wed, 01 Sep 2010, 3:22pm Long time climate change skeptic Bjørn Lomborg, changes his tune »
Fibb
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Lens also didn't grasp the "logarithmic but not over time" part. Don't waste your time people.

Last edited Wed, 01 Sep 2010, 3:30pm by Fibb


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Wed, 01 Sep 2010, 3:16pm Long time climate change skeptic Bjørn Lomborg, changes his tune »
Fibb
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supamark wrote:

also, CO2 is non-polar, and is not "attracting" water lol.

LOL is right. I did when I read that. Lens, where did you pull that out of?


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Wed, 01 Sep 2010, 11:40am Long time climate change skeptic Bjørn Lomborg, changes his tune »
Fibb
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Lensman wrote:

Shame on you, AD2. This is despicable. You're not fit to wipe Lomborg's shoes.

AD who?


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Wed, 01 Sep 2010, 10:59am Long time climate change skeptic Bjørn Lomborg, changes his tune »
Fibb
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Kahuna wrote:

This guy never was "a denier." This was just a desperate attempt to find some good news in a time of near total meltdown of the AGW cause. The UK Telegraph exposed the story here:

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpo...

The Guardian is a much better source for coverage on this flip flopper.

He has definitely said some contradictory things and at times been a poster boy for the anti-AGW crowd.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/aug/...


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Wed, 01 Sep 2010, 10:53am Long time climate change skeptic Bjørn Lomborg, changes his tune »
Fibb
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Lensman wrote:

Two questions, Mark:

1. Is there a saturation level of CO2 regarding global warming? That is, a level beyond which no further increase in PPM will cause a significant increase in retention of infrared energy?

Let's not wait and find out. The surface temperature of Venus can melt lead, iirc.


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Wed, 01 Sep 2010, 10:51am Long time climate change skeptic Bjørn Lomborg, changes his tune »
Fibb
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Lensman wrote:

Far too much has been made of CO2's contribution to global warming. Other factors, such as methane, are an even bigger influence,

Lens, you realize the tundra/permafrost is melting and methane release is accelerating, right?


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Wed, 01 Sep 2010, 10:50am Long time climate change skeptic Bjørn Lomborg, changes his tune »
Fibb
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nekote wrote:

If AGW really is true, *slowing* the rate of CO2 (Kyoto) isn't going to get the job done, is it.

CO2 will have to be removed from the atmosphere.
Presumably with all deliberate speed.

Which will be very, very expensive, if done in today's technology.

YES and perhaps.

A prudent civilization, given the balance of probabilities/risk assessment would at the very least try to stop putting more CO2 up there ASAP, especially if it would only cost 1-3% of GDP and create national security benefits and health benefits.


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Mon, 30 Aug 2010, 10:00pm EPA Proposes New PHEV and EV Fuel Economy Labels, Wants Your Comments »
Fibb
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Lensman wrote:

There should be completely separate ratings for kWh usage when using electric power, and for MPG when using the ICE.

It appears to me that it does.

Lensman wrote:

And the electric power rating should *not* be in so-called "MPG equivalent".

yes, kill that nonsense.

Lensman wrote:

The rating should be in miles/kWh, or something similar.

Good idea, and the lable should give an example of how people can calculate their electric only $/mile rate from the miles/kWh figure.

Lensman wrote:

Perhaps miles/10 kWh would be better, because it would give numbers somewhat closer to typical MPG ratings.

Nah, keep the numbers dissimilar.


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Sat, 28 Aug 2010, 11:27am China positioning to set standards for EVs »
Fibb
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I agree, in NA we have our heads up our butts while the rest of the world modernizes.


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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Fri, 27 Aug 2010, 8:16pm Critical paths in a ramp up to mass production »
Fibb
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energy investor wrote:

Fibb, I don't agree.

The entire value chain must be engineered and much of this will be in the public domain.

Such as suppliers, fast chargers, electric motors, zennergy drive, OEM relationships and testing of end products and lots and lots of things.

kind regards
ei

I hope you're right of course, but I've heard EEV say stealth would be beneficial until there is revenue. Sounds like revenue comes a long way down the road from here.


Dick Weir will not go quietly in the night, he will bring forth the new EESU, for EESU reveal day is our Independence day! - Futureman 100/10

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